--- title: Tradition Meets Transformation With Jason Nickles description: "Modern Woodmen's Jason Nickles on leading change inside a legacy organization: modernizing systems and culture while honoring tradition." image: https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/hubfs/Imported_Blog_Media/ep-16-Jason-1.png --- [![Velocity Advisory Group](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/Velocity-Logo-2023-Wide-1.png)](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/) ☰ Menu - About - [Meet Our Team](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/about/) - [Meet Our Coaches](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/coaches/) - [Careers](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/careers/) - [Speaking Engagements](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/velocity-speakers/) - Solutions - [Culture & Engagement](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/culture-engagement/) - [DISC Assessments & Training](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/disc-assessments-training/) - [Employee Experience](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/employee-experience/) - [Executive Coaching](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/executive-coaching/) - [Family Business](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/family-business/) - [Leadership Development](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/leadership-development/) - [Sales Training](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/5cs-of-selling/) - [Strategy & Implementation](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/strategy-implementation/) - Resources - [Activating Greatness Podcast](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/podcast/) - [Blog](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/blog/) - [Case Studies](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/case-studies/) - [News and Announcements](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/news-and-events/) - [OrderDisc](https://orderdisc.com/) - [Upcoming Events](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/upcoming-events/) - Industries - [Construction](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/construction/) - [Financial Services](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/financial-services/) - [Life Sciences](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/lifesciences/) - [Contact](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/contact/) Activating Greatness Podcast Episodes March 26, 2026 | Episode 16 # How to Modernize a Legacy Organization Without Losing Its Tradition — with Jason Nickles ## Let the Data Make the Case: Jason Nickles on Modernizing a Legacy Organization **In this post:** *Modern Woodmen of America's Jason Nickles explains how he is modernizing a fraternal tradition that dates to 1883: gather the brutal facts, let people experience the change through pilots, build advocates, and celebrate small wins.* On paper, the attendance numbers looked great. Modern Woodmen of America has about 700,000 members, and its local events drew more than 300,000 attendees. Then Jason Nickles and his team looked closer. "What you found when you really broke down the data is, yeah, we're getting a lot of repeat attendees," Nickles, Chief Fraternal Officer at Modern Woodmen, said on *Activating Greatness*, the leadership podcast from Velocity Advisory Group. The number of unique members who showed up was much lower. "That was an eye opening awakening for all of us." That finding became the foundation of a deliberate effort to modernize a legacy organization. Nickles' lesson for leaders facing the same task is to prove the case for change with evidence before proposing any solution. ## A Mission Older Than the Model Modern Woodmen is a fraternal benefit society founded in 1883, originally to care for widows and orphans. Everyone who does business with it is a member, united by three common bonds: financial security, quality family life, and community impact. Nickles has spent more than two decades at the organization in training, field development, and leadership roles. He now oversees the fraternal side, which brings members together through about 3,000 local chapters for social, educational, and volunteer activities. Participation is optional, and like many member organizations, Modern Woodmen saw it decline, especially during the pandemic. Busy families have less time for local events. When Nickles returned to the department, the president and CEO challenged his team to "bring fraternal to the front" as part of a long-term vision to grow membership. The aim was to highlight the fraternal difference, attract new members, keep existing ones loyal, and turn them into advocates. ## Gather the Brutal Facts Nickles took his starting point from Jim Collins' *Good to Great*: gather the brutal facts. In sales and training, he said, success is easy to measure. Volunteering and community work are harder, a problem he believes many nonprofit organizations share. His team worked with IT and the home office data department to learn who attended events, their demographics, and how often they came. They surveyed members, the field force, and the volunteers who run chapters. The data showed that the fraternal side was a major reason people joined and stayed, but many members did not know what it offered. The numbers also settled arguments. When a regional sales office insisted its events were thriving, Nickles pulled out the data. "This is what the data shows. This isn't me," he would tell them. "This is your unique member engagement." "Data is powerful," he said. "We take it for granted." He spent the first year taking that case to every audience, from the field to the board of directors. Only after people agreed that change was needed did he ask the next question: How bold do you want to go? A modest change would give a temporary boost. "We're looking long term, long after I'm retired," he said. Most agreed it was time for bold, transformational change. > "Data is powerful. We take it for granted." > > *Jason Nickles, Chief Fraternal Officer, Modern Woodmen of America* ## Let People Experience the Future The new direction centers on bigger, bolder events. Most chapter events had been small. Nickles asked whether a member would rather attend an event with 10 people or one with 100, 200, or 300 people having fun and doing community service together. A coworker sharpened the point by asking what a five-person event says about the brand. "That kind of hit me," Nickles said. "What does that say about our brand and how do people perceive you?" Rather than announce a new model, the team tested it with 30 pilot events in Tennessee and events in nine other states. Not every event was perfect. But field leaders saw for themselves how it differed from what they had always done, and that, he said, "really helped change mindset about what it could be versus what it currently is." FREE ONE-PAGE CHECKLIST ### The Case-for-Change Checklist Use it to gather the data that proves change is needed, test the new approach with a pilot, and line up advocates before you roll it out. [Get the free checklist](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/leadership-library/case-for-change-checklist) ## Turnkey, With Guardrails Some of Modern Woodmen's most successful regions are in Southern California around Orange County and Los Angeles. Others are rural. Nickles' answer is a system that is turnkey everywhere but gives each region flexibility, within guardrails, to choose events and service that fit its community. The old model rewarded checked boxes, such as a fundraiser or a volunteer project. The new one focuses on the quality of the experience. Tony Greco described a similar balance in [building aligned regional teams](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-10-from-proximity-to-purpose-tony-greco). ## Build Advocates, Then Keep Listening Nickles is candid that the work is unfinished. "Change is so hard," he said. People like to hold on to the way they have always done things. His countermeasure is advocates: key field leaders who believe in the direction, backed by a board and president who support it. After presenting a chapter model of the future to a group of sales managers, he called many of them individually. Most liked the direction, then raised "what about this?" questions. He welcomes them. "We can make this change, make it good, but we can make it even that much better if we just tweak it a little bit," he said. His next step was a three-day think tank with 20 field leaders, including reps, managing partners, and regional directors. "We're all in this together," he said. Jeremy Maskel explained why that kind of peer messaging spreads in [leadership communication that sticks](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-18-say-it-so-it-sticks-jeremy-maskel). His team also rewrote its department mission: "to captivate the next generation of members through meaningful modern experiences." Success is measured by member engagement, which rose significantly last year as the pilots got underway. ## Celebrate the Small Wins Patience does not come naturally to Nickles. "I want things done now and yesterday," he admitted. His team of 17 helped him slow down, and he learned to "celebrate the small wins along the way. I don't think we do that enough." At a year-end luncheon, the team went around the table naming wins. The big change was still in progress, but "when you added up all the things we did along the way, it's a lot." ## Key Takeaways 1. **Prove the case before you pick the solution.** Nickles spent a year gathering data and sharing it with every audience before deciding what the change would be. 2. **Measure what matters, not what flatters.** Total attendance looked strong. Unique member engagement told the real story. 3. **Let people experience the change.** Pilot events showed field leaders what the future could look like in a way no presentation could. 4. **Build advocates and invite pushback.** Peer champions, one-on-one follow-up calls, and a field think tank turn objections into improvements. 5. **Celebrate small wins on a long road.** Transformation takes years. Naming progress keeps teams motivated while the bigger goal is still in the works. HOW VELOCITY HELPS ### Velocity Culture & Engagement Nickles built his case for change on surveys, stakeholder feedback, and a hard look at engagement data, then brought the field along before rolling anything out. Velocity's Culture & Engagement work follows a similar path through culture assessments, engagement surveys, and stakeholder interviews, then builds on those findings in the High Performance Culture Workshop. Leaders gain an objective picture of where engagement stands and a shared starting point for change that people support. See how Velocity works with [financial services firms](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/financial-services/). [Explore Culture & Engagement](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/culture-engagement/) ## The Takeaway: Connect the Change to the Goal The best leadership advice Nickles received was to make sure his department's actions support the organization's goals, and then to evangelize those goals to his team. When people see the big picture and connect the dots, he said, "you get better buy in for the change you're trying to lead." His daily habit reinforces that trust: checking in with everyone on his team, often about family rather than work, because "people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care." He also picks a word to guide each year. Last year it was "bold." This year it is "imagine." For any leader trying to modernize a legacy organization, the order matters: gather the facts, tie them to the mission, let people imagine and then experience the future, and only then ask them to change. ## Listen to the Full Episode Hear Jason Nickles' full conversation with host Alec McChesney on *Activating Greatness*. [Watch on YouTube](https://youtu.be/mkvEQhm_7E8), or listen on [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/4LcgAut0KyYiGyDhFvMjPD) and [Apple Podcasts](https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/id1868386871). Follow Jason on [LinkedIn](https://www.linkedin.com/in/jason-nickles-4037787/). FREE GUIDE ### The Change-Readiness Check Nickles proved the case for change with data, then let people experience it through pilots before asking them to adopt it. This short framework helps you test whether your change is truly experienced by your team or simply announced, and whether people can connect it to your organization's goals. [Get the free guide](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/leadership-library/change-readiness-check) Share: [facebook-f icon](http://www.facebook.com/share.php?u=https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-16-tradition-meets-transformation-jason-nickles) [linkedin-in icon](http://www.linkedin.com/shareArticle?mini=true&url=https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-16-tradition-meets-transformation-jason-nickles) [Twitter icon](https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?url=https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-16-tradition-meets-transformation-jason-nickles) [pinterest-p icon](http://pinterest.com/pin/create/link/?url=https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-16-tradition-meets-transformation-jason-nickles) [envelope icon](mailto:?body=https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-16-tradition-meets-transformation-jason-nickles) [Strategy & Change](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/strategy-change) [Financial Services & Insurance](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/financial-services-insurance) ## Ready to activate greatness on your team? Velocity Advisory Group helps leadership teams build the culture, strategy, and systems that let good people do their best work. [Book a discovery call](https://www.velocityadvisorygroup.com/contact/) ## Related posts [HR & People Strategy](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/hr-people-strategy), [Financial Services & Insurance](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/financial-services-insurance) ## [Episode 49: Recruiting Financial Advisors: Hire Entrepreneurs First — with Chad Foster](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-49-recruiting-financial-advisors-chad-foster) [Alec McChesney](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/author/alec-mcchesney) Sep 21, 2026, 4:00:00 AM This Career Is Not for Most: Chad Foster on Recruiting Entrepreneurs in Financial Services In this... [Read more](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-49-recruiting-financial-advisors-chad-foster) [Accountability & High Performance](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/accountability-high-performance), [Strategy & Change](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/strategy-change) ## [Episode 46: Evolving Organizational Culture Through Crisis and Growth — with Tom Ulbrich](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-46-evolving-organizational-culture-tom-ulbrich) [Alec McChesney](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/author/alec-mcchesney) Sep 8, 2026, 4:00:00 AM Evolve, Don't Replace: Tom Ulbrich on Growing Goodwill From $6 Million to $25 Million In this post:... [Read more](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-46-evolving-organizational-culture-tom-ulbrich) [Culture & Engagement](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/culture-engagement), [Strategy & Change](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/tag/strategy-change) ## [Episode 33: Leading Transformational Change: Why Shaping the Path Works — with Melissa Pepper](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-33-leading-transformational-change-melissa-pepper) [Alec McChesney](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/author/alec-mcchesney) Jun 15, 2026, 4:00:00 AM Shape the Path: Melissa Pepper on Why Change Fails and How to Make It Stick In this post: Lead(h)er... [Read more](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-33-leading-transformational-change-melissa-pepper) --- [![](https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/hs-fs/hubfs/Velocity%20Logo%202023%20Wide-2.png?width=1025&height=267&name=Velocity%20Logo%202023%20Wide-2.png)](http://velocityadvisorygroup.com) Copyright © 2026, Velocity Advisory Group ```json { "@context" : "https://schema.org", "@type" : "BlogPosting", "author" : { "@type" : "Person", "name" : "Alec McChesney", "url" : "https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/author/alec-mcchesney" }, "dateModified" : "2026-10-20T15:04:45.327Z", "datePublished" : "2026-03-26T06:56:00.000Z", "headline" : "Tradition Meets Transformation With Jason Nickles", "image" : [ "https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/hubfs/Imported_Blog_Media/ep-16-Jason-1.png" ], "mainEntityOfPage" : { "@id" : "https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/activating-greatness-podcast-episodes/ep-16-tradition-meets-transformation-jason-nickles", "@type" : "WebPage" }, "publisher" : { "@type" : "Organization", "logo" : { "@type" : "ImageObject", "url" : "https://coaching.velocityadvisorygroup.com/hubfs/Velocity%20Logo%202023%20Wide-2.png" }, "name" : "Velocity Advisory Group" } } ```